RBC

Details of the HSBC to RBC transition (Last updated April 1)

Patrick S News

RBC has laid out a timeline for the transition of banking products from HSBC to RBC and they aren’t wasting any time with the migration!

April 1: The points conversion ratio and value is starting to emerge and RBC has clarified some of the details for us.

HSBC clients will be receiving letters from RBC that will explain the points conversion ratio and increased redemption rate for their points to show how they will get more value for the points in regards to the flexible travel redemption value.

For example, many clients have seen their points are converting at 1 HSBC Rewards Point to 0.36 Avion Points. At first glance, this does not look like it is an equal or better value for flexible travel however RBC will be giving those clients a flexible travel redemption rate of 100 points to $1.50 (instead of the standard 100 points to $1) This means those who receive the 0.36 points conversion will end up getting a value of 0.54 cents per point which is .04 cents higher than the flexible travel redemption rate HSBC Rewards previously provided.

Continuing with the 0.36 ratio this means HSBC clients who receive this specific conversion rate will receive up to .84 cents per point (0.36 x 2.33 cpp) when redeeming for flights via the Avion Air Travel Redemption schedule. This works out to 0.34 cents per point higher than the old HSBC Rewards flexible travel redemption rate.

In terms of converting to airlines, those clients who get 0.36 Avion points per 1 HSBC Reward point will be a little worse off for conversions to British Airways as they used to get 0.4 Avios per HSBC Reward point and now the Avios equivalent is 0.36. However they will be better off for Asia Miles as they used to get 0.32 Asia Miles per HSBC Reward Point and now their equivalent is 0.36 Asia Miles per point.

 

February 27: If you have HSBC International Premier Status you will retain that status for 5 years. Thanks to Mauro for sending this our way!

  • If you’re an HSBC Premier customer in other international HSBC locations based on your HSBC Premier status at HSBC Bank Canada, you will keep your Premier status in those HSBC locations for 5 years* after March 28, 2024.
  • After this period, you’ll need to meet the qualification criteria in each HSBC location where you’re a Premier customer to avoid monthly fees or an automatic downgrade, as applicable.
  • You can expect further communication directly from each HSBC location regarding the continuation of your international Premier status.

February 27: New article from RWRDS Canada – read this if you have upcoming travel and the related coverage from your HSBC card: Important detail on HSBC Mastercard Emergency Travel Medical Coverage for those with existing travel bookings

February 27: If you are an HSBC client who is unhappy with migration and want to voice your concerns here is the process to undertake! (Thanks to JB for these details as he did file a complaint with the FCAC)

The Financial Consumer Agency of Canada (FCAC) has replied to my concerns. What it basically boils down to is: they say they acknowledge the receipt of my information and will use this in engaging with RBC (FWIW). They advise me to first raise my concerns directly through RBC’s complaint-handling process. If this doesn’t resolve it, appeal to an External Complaints Body (ECB). All the steps of the process must be followed in sequential order

February 22: Emails have been sent out to HSBC clients advising them of the timeline to use their points via HSBC Rewards. Thanks to Mauro for sending this our way!

  • Redeem your points for miles swap with one of our airline partners by February 29, 2024.
  • Redeem your points by March 14, 2024, for a mortgage credit, savings credit, book travel, merchandise, donations or a physical gift card.
  • Redeem your points by March 25, 2024, for a travel reward credit, a digital gift card, a credit card statement credit or a travel enhancement credit (if applicable).
  • If you don’t redeem your HSBC points before the specific dates outlined, don’t worry – your unused points will be converted to Avion® points at a comparative value with your new RBC Credit Card. You will receive your new points and can start redeeming at avionrewards.com or on the Avion Rewards app one week after the migration date.

February 20: RWRDS Canada has the exclusive details on HSBC Rewards to Avion Rewards points conversions. Learn more here

February 19: In my discussions with RBC about the conversion rate from HSBC Rewards to RBC Avion Rewards we do have one piece of news that we can share with you right now. I asked them if they will be inheriting the Singapore Airlines KrisFlyer points to miles conversion option that is offered in HSBC Rewards and they have confirmed they will not be. Thus with February 29, 2024 being the last day you can convert points to miles in the HSBC Rewards program, you will want to do so by then if you have had plans to convert to Singapore Airlines KrisFlyer.

February 18: As first pointed out on RFD and then on Milesopedia, HSBC has published February 29 as the last day to be able to convert HSBC Rewards points to their airline partners British Airways, Cathay Pacific and Singapore Airlines. The big question remains is to what the HSBC Rewards to Avion Rewards points conversion ratio will be and whether you should wait or not to let your points convert to Avion and then transfer to BA or Cathay (or for any other redemption). I can tell you that Rewards Canada has had great progress with RBC since we let you know that we reached out to them and if everything works out, we should have the details on the conversion for our readers later this week.

February 12: As mentioned in our This Week in RWRDS newscast we have reached out to RBC to find out why they are not revealing the HSBC Rewards to Avion Rewards points conversion ratio and that they should make it public. This is something that HSBC customers should be made aware of as soon as possible so they can make an informed decision on what to do with their points rather than it being dictated by RBC by keeping cardholders in the dark. We’ll keep you in the loop as soon as we find something out!

February 7: We have published a new article: The best Mastercard options to replace HSBC Mastercards

February 2: We now have confirmation that the HSBC Rewards+ Mastercard is being migrated to the RBC Ion Visa. There are no extras/benefits being offered to those cardholders being transitioned. It has also been confirmed the HSBC Premier Mastercard is migrating to the RBC Rewards Visa Preferred. Thank you to Oznej and Maxwell!

February 1: We now have confirmation that the HSBC Travel Rewards Mastercard is being transferred to RBC ION Visa Card There are no extras/benefits being offered to those cardholders being transitioned. Thank you to Lei Ann!

January 30: We now have confirmation that the HSBC Metal World Elite Mastercard (nee Jade World Elite) is being migrated to the RBC Avion Visa Infinite Privilege Card.   I saw someone post their letter on Reddit while I was on my phone the other day but now can’t find that post to properly reference it. If I recall correctly from that post, these clients will benefit from no annual fee, 0% FX Fees (aka No FX fees) and a one time travel credit of up to $400 (If one of our readers can confirm these benefits that would be greatly appreciated)

January 23: We now have confirmation that the HSBC Cash Rewards Mastercard is being migrated to the RBC Cash Back Mastercard. No additional extras for HSBC clients being moved over as the RBC card has the potential to offer better cash back rewards.  Thank you to Kiraly on RFD!

January 22: We now have confirmation that the HSBC World Elite Mastercard are being transferred to RBC Avion Visa Infinite cards and these clients will receive 0% FX Fees (aka No FX fees) and a one time travel credit of up to $200. As well, additional/supplementary cards will be $0. See below for all the details. Thank you to Ilia NC!

January 19: One more update listed below of unconfirmed details that select HSBC credit card holders will receive Avion credit cards with extra benefits and/or no annual fees. See details below.

January 17: The post has been updated with some more details below.

Here’s the timeline graphic from RBC’s website:

Based on this timeline HSBC clients will be receiving details of the transition very soon and can expect to be fully transitioned by the end of March! That’s quick!

I really thought that the transition would take longer and that the credit card portfolios wouldn’t be some of the earliest targeted products for transition to RBC. Granted, the details don’t actually specify what the transition will be, will it simply be the card numbers, accounts etc. being migrated to RBC and those cards remain the same in terms of earn rates, benefits etc. for sometime into the future or will these be actual product switches?  It appears it will be the latter based on the timeline above stating “You will receive your RBC Royal Bank credit card(s), if applicable” and it makes a lot of sense for RBC to do this now.

Cards like the HSBC World Elite Mastercard earn 2, 4 and 6 points per dollar spent with an actual respective minimum return of 1%, 2%, and 3%. Compare this to the card I would assume most if not all HSBC World Elite Mastercard holders will be transitioned to, which is the RBC Avion Visa Infinite Card that earns 1 and 1.25 points per dollar spent. Those RBC points have an actual respective minimum return of 1% and 1.25%.

As you can see by transitioning cardholders to actual RBC products sooner than later, the bank would stand to save up to 1.75% on accelerated earn rate purchases that HSBC cardholders would be making. So, for them it makes sense to transition cardholders as soon as possible.  (This is based on minimum redemption values for travel. The savings to RBC will vary for other redemption options.)

Not only is it the points but it is also the foreign transaction fees and other benefits. The sooner those HSBC World Elite’s are transferred over the sooner RBC starts earning revenue from those cardholders for purchases made in other currencies as RBC does not feature No Foreign Transaction fee benefits. HSBC clients appear to be receiving an exclusive 0% FX fee option with the Avion Infinite cards they will be migrated to.

RBC also does not offer lounge access on the Avion Visa Infinite (They do on the Infinite Privilege) so the bank will be able to stop paying the fee to Mastercard & DragonPass. Not to mention, RBC will no longer have to worry about the annual $100 travel enhancement credit.

Just writing those last paragraph makes me sad that we stand to lose the HSBC World Elite Mastercard! And, unfortunately I don’t foresee RBC coming out with a comparable product or updating the Avion Visa Infinite Card as there is no need for them to do so with such a large existing cardmember base already in place.

January 17 update:

Product Migration

RBC has now added a new Product Migration Guide to their website that also has a very long PDF document detailing lots of product changes but actually not much detail at all about credit cards or the loyalty programs. The credit card info is Section 5 (Page 105 of the PDF not the document) and the loyalty program info is Section 6 (Page 127 of the PDF not the document)

Here’s what we do know from the guide

  • No Foreign Transaction fees will not carry over to RBC  (this was anticipated as it’s too big of money maker for the bank with their existing cardmembers) HSBC clients appear to be receiving an exclusive 0% FX fee option with the Avion Infinite cards they will be migrated to.
  • HSBC Rewards credit cards will transition to Avion Rewards cards
  • HSBC Cash Back credit card will transition to an RBC cash back card
  • HSBC Rewards points will be transferred to Avion Rewards points maintaining a comparative value.

What they don’t disclose is what that “comparative value” will be. Will it be based on the most recent earn rates on the HSBC cards? If so, the transfer will most likely be 2 HSBC Rewards Points to 1 RBC Avion Rewards points. But there is also the question of outstanding points balances that were earned on the HSBC cards when they had higher base earn rates of 3 points per dollar. That could push the conversion rate to 2.5 or even 3 HSBC Rewards Points to 1 RBC Avion Rewards point. I hope that’s not the case but I’m just putting it out there that it is a possibility. But again it could be a wash since the newer accelerated earn rates on the card offer 4 points to potentially balance out the 2 base points. I guess we just have to wait and see.

These are the credit card migrations that RWRDS Canada anticipates will happen. This has not been published nor confirmed by RBC. This list is our best guess and will be updated once we begin to receive concrete details from our readers and/or RBC:

January 17 Update #2:

Thanks to long time RWRDS Canada reader Mauro for reminding me what the government set out as conditions for the credit card part of this transition:

  • Provide information to all HSBC clients about their credit cards at least 60 days before the closing date. Specifically, RBC will inform HSBC clients that:
    • RBC will offer them credit cards that have substantially similar benefits to those that they held with HSBC, including fee structures; and,
    • RBC will convert any HSBC clients’ unused rewards points on the acquisition closing date into RBC rewards points of a substantially similar value.
  • Not to interfere with the continued use of credit cards issued by HSBC, including the collection, redemption, or transfer of any rewards points associated with those cards, up until the closing of the acquisition.

This puts an interesting twist on the transition and migration if the HSBC World Elite Mastercard is transitioned to the RBC Avion Visa Infinite card. It potentially does not meet the first sub-point of “RBC will offer them credit cards that have substantially similar benefits to those that they held with HSBC, including fee structures”

I would personally argue that if we compare the RBC Avion Visa Infinite Card and the HSBC World Elite Mastercard, they do not have substantially similar benefits. The Avion card has no lounge access membership, it has no annual travel enhancement credit, its insurance coverage isn’t as good (Especially for 65+), it has less flexible travel redemptions in that you can’t book travel on your own without losing value, its minimum earn to burn ratio provides less value than HSBC and it charges foreign transaction fees. Those were (and still are) major benefits of the HSBC World Elite Mastercard.

So unless RBC updates the Avion card or comes out with a totally new card this could be just cause for a challenge from HSBC cardholders. I’m not sure how the regulators would see this and I’m not an expert in this sort of matter so perhaps we can get some of our more legally inclined readers to chime in about RBC potentially not meeting that condition?

January 19 update:

According to what could be considered an anonymous account post on Red Flag deals, some HSBC card clients will receive RBC Avion cards with extras and/or free of charge:

PCS clients who had an “RBC” [sic] WE Metal card will be getting the Avion Privilege card free of charge.

There will be clients who will get RBC Avion cards with a no fx feature. Every client will be receiving a personal package in February detailing their specific offer. This is highly personalized and if the card is thereafter cancelled it cannot be obtained again.

Posting from a throwaway for obvious reasons, won’t be responding to questions. Don’t cancel your cards!

It is possible this was posted by an RBC or HSBC employee and we have not confirmed the validity of it. However it would make sense for RBC to do so as it may be enough to meet the condition of “substantially similar benefits”. I’m not sure if the alluding of RBC Avion Card with a no FX fee only applies to the Visa Infinite Privilege migrations from HSBC Metal World Elite or if this will include the standard HSBC World Elite Mastercard to RBC Avion Visa Infinite cards.

January 22 update:

Ilia NC posted details in the comments below that they received a big envelope today. Their HSBC World Elite Mastercard will be converted to an RBC Avion Visa Infinite Card that will feature No FX Fees and one time travel credit as follows:

For any eligible hotel stay or car rental booking of $200 or more you make with Avion Rewards Travel using your RBC Avion Visa Infinite credit card until one year after the card migration date, you will receive a statement credit of an amount equivalent to any unused balance of your HSBC Travel Enhancement credit, plus an additional $100 (together, “Travel Credit”).

So HSBC cardholders will get the 0% FX Fee option (That’s going to make existing RBC Avion cardholders furious), and only a one time credit for use in the first year (albeit up to 2x the value) and not every year like the HSBC card offers. There is also no airport lounge membership and as Ilia points out – you can’t use the card at Costco.

HSBC clients migrated to the RBC Avion will also get additional/supplementary cards at $0. Regular RBC Avion Visa Infinite cardholders have to pay $50. Another item that HSBC clients get that can make existing RBC Avion cardholders furious!

That begs the question are these benefits substantially similar?

  • FX fee? Yes.
  • Travel Credit? No, since it’s only one time
  • Annual airport lounge membership? No
  • Minimum redemption value of 1 to 3%? No, only 1 to 1.25%
  • $0 additional/supplementary cards: Yes.
  • Use card at Costco? No
  • Free global Wi-Fi? No

Hard to say if these are substantially similar. I’d love to hear everyone’s thoughts on this! Personally, I’d  be concerned that within a couple of years, once the transition is no longer front and centre,  RBC will do away with offering 0% fees for the clients that are transferred over.

Wrapping it up

RBC has laid out the details of the migration and transition of HSBC products and it is happening quickly! The bank hopes to have all transitions done by the end of March. And on April 1st, everything should be running under RBC, even the physical HSBC Bank locations will be opening as RBC locations on April 1 (and that’s not an April Fool’s joke)

We still don’t have a lot of details in the actual product transitions but those should start emerging fairly quickly as RBC is sending out letters to HSBC customers this month.

Help the RWRDS Canada community

If you are a current HSBC credit cardholder (any one of their cards) we would love to hear from you when you receive your letter from RBC about the transition. Our goal is to create a reference showing what each HSBC card will be migrated to in RBC’s credit card portfolio.

Click here to learn more about the HSBC-RBC transition process